Recently, the Library of Congress announced their latest additions to the National Film Registry, where films are set aside for special preservation. Now, in addition to artistic merit, one of the criteria considered for inclusion on the Registry is cultural impact It seems to me that even bad movies (even really bad movies) can fit that second criteria.
Kenneth then asks if “‘Manos’ The Hands of Fate” should receive that designation, but I — with the “Film Anti-Preservation Society” host segment having just been discussed in the episode guide — want to open up the question.
What “bad” or B movie (MSTed or otherwise) deserves preservation based on that “cultural impact” clause?
MSTed: I would have to go with “Robot Monster.” It’s a bad movie icon.
Non-MSTed: Well, the first thing that comes to mind is “Rocky Horror Picture Show” — and based on some of the HORRIBLE prints I have seen circulating in the last couple of decades, preservation is sorely overdue.
Your thoughts?
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I would say GIrl in Gold Boots. Simply because the print used on MST3k contained, albeit, some very funny missing and cropped scenes. But I specifically bought the DVD hoping to get the complete scenes in full. And instead, the scenes were simply cut from the DVD version I had bought. Perhaps the very earliest release on VHS from the late 80’s may have a complete version . I say preserve this film before it’s gone altogether!
I second Angry Red Planet. The bat-spider-crab-thing was actually pretty cool for it’s time. Also, Gerald Mohr stars and we all remember him from Invasion U.S.A.
@ #41: Ever since Shout took over the DVD releases, the question of likelihood is really a non-issue, judging from the way they snap up titles that were previously considered untouchable.
#51
You’re ignoring the possibility that that child Buzz did
actually teleport into the diner. (Perhaps as part of a
Communist plot to subvert American democracy…in a way I
heven’t quite figured out yet).
Avatar is digital, not film so it needs to be backed up on hard drive, not preserved.
#53:
VERY good point! Shout! ROCKS! :)
For good or bad, ‘Porky’s’ pioneered the 80’s teen sex comedy.
I have Rocky Horror Picture Show on blu-ray and it is a great transfer, so it seems like it is fine already. MST3K: Squirm or Final Sacrifice would be good movies to preserve, to show that despite miniscule budgets, they aren’t terrible(Final Sacrifice had a budget of $1500, Manos had about 10x that.)
Un-MST’d: Maximum Overdrive. Stephen King’s only directing effort and after that he swore off directing any other films and described it as a “Idiot movie” Out of the hundreds of movies that have been made from his books or stories, he considers that the worst one, and is one of the more famous ones. Plus, having that awesome soundtrack in HD sound would be great.
MiSTied: Definitely agree with Manos as a possible contender. However, the one MiSTied film that has the best chance of making it into the registry is I Was a Teenage Werewolf as it was not only a big hit at the time of release, but it was also innovative with the concept of a teenager being turned into a monster.
Non-MiSTied: No question. Plan 9 from Outer Space. Not only is the film pretty much one of the most well-known “bad” movies of all time, but also the fact that the film plays with the “aliens intervening to prevent nuclear destruction” theme that was common with a number of sci-fi films at the time (would consider The Space Children in the MiStied section as well, but I don’t think that one is as well known as Plan 9 and Teenage Werewolf).
Rocky Horror, preserved? THAT’S the most horrific thing I’ve heard all day, and am likely to hear.
I think MST3K itself has far more cultural impact than ANY of the ****ty movies they have riffed.
I am NOT in favor of anything by Roger Corman being in the National Film Registry. The guy was a huckster who made ****ty movies just to make money, and kept the budgets and timing so low that prevented them from possibly being any good. For some reason people seem to forget that now that he’s old. He’s just a guy who threw such a resounding amount of **** on the wall that a little bit of it just happened to stick. This is why I was so mad when he got an Oscar for other peoples’ accomplishments after they stopped working for him.
As for Manos, it’s just another really bad movie. It’s only “cultural signifigance” is that for a while a lot of people thought it was the worst movie ever. The Best Brains themselves have said numerous times that there were a ton of other movies so bad they couldn’t even be on the show.
Since it did have a low budget, I guess the original Night of the Living Dead counts, but it is a good movie too.
I actually got a tour of Library of Congress last week, and while there’s a lot of (subjectively) good movies I’d like to see on the National Film Registry, if you made me pick MST3K titles, I’d probably go with “The Magic Sword” and “This Island Earth”, as they’re both watchable and have a history outside of just being featured as part of the show.
As for non-MST bad movies I’d pick… where to begin? There’s a Tobe Hooper pic called “Lifeforce” that is ASTOUNDING in how weird it is. “The Apple” (another Cannon production) I’d get on there just to give it some attention.
I also recommend “Robot Monster” since Ro-Man has become an icon of bad movie monsters. “The Apple” is so singularly weird and entertaining, it literally must be seen by everyone to be believed. A disco-musical bible story: Almost too awesome to exist!
I’d also suggest the animated “Hobbit” movie by Rankin-Bass and Don Bluth’s early work. There are a lot of truly great animated films that get ignored because the general public think the whole genre begins and ends with Disney. “Hobbit” was a beautifully drawn picture that perfectly adapted the novel, (in ONE film Jackson!). Bluth’s “Secret of NIMH” and “American Tail” had stories with a dark edge. They made an impression on me as a kid, making me realize how many cartoons had been dumbed down for kids.
And “Short Circuit”, the most 80’s movie ever made.
Roger Corman’s 1950s sci-fi films were impactful, I think – as were his Edgar Allan Poe films (especially Masque of the Red Death). I think the carrot monster from “It Conqered the World” has achieved a certain level of iconic status.
I have to agree that I would not really think that anything by Corman should be in the National Film Registry. While he gave a lot of great talents their break and helped to make the careers of some wonderful filmmakers and actors, there is no way to say that if it wasn’t for Roger Corman Martin Scorsese would never have become a great director, or Nicholson a great actor. They may have been just as successful with or without Corman. But he does deserve some recognition for that. His actual body of work, on the other hand, is pretty underwhelming. He was in the business to make money, not art. And while not all motion pictures are art, and a great many on the Registry are far from it, Corman’s pictures represent low water marks for film making in almost every instance. The only pictures that I think of his that could possibly be considered would be one of the Poe pictures or “The Intruder,” which by many accounts was his best work, and had some cultural significance. It’s is not as though these films will not live on if they are not in the registry like some other pictures. Corman has a following and pretty much all of his pictures are available today in a variety of formats. It’s not like if someone in the future asks what a Corman film is, they won’t be able to see what kind of schlock he produced. Preserving them in the registry so that people in the future can view a pristine copy of “Attack of the Crab Monsters,” is in my opinion a waste of resources. As far as his sci-fi films being representative of the genre, I guess my opinion is that there are a great many other films from that era that do a much better job representing that genre than his.
I think the same can be said for films like “Manos” and “Monster A Go Go.” Outside of our little circle of B movie aficionados, no one has heard of these films, and that is not necessarily a bad thing. I truly enjoy watching a lot of these bad films, even un-riffed, but I would not consider my tastes in movies normal. I mean, these movies are awful.
As far as what riffed movie deserves to be in the Registry, well, deserves is a tough one, but the whole cultural impact thing… I would probably say “Amazing Colossal Man,” or one of the juvenile delinquent movies like “Girls Town” or “The Violent Years.” I think Colossal Man was probably one of the better sci-fi films that they did and I think it had an impact somewhat beyond B movie status.
Anyway, good topic!
Hangar 18 had some cultural impact, I think. And if not, well, it has Gary Collins in it. His hair deserves to be immortalized.
Riding with Death showcases how for a brief time, CB Radio managed to inject itself into everyday American life. Sort of like Twitter or Facebook (Or I guess, Myspace)
And non MST3K movies, I would go with Repo Man.
Cultural impact, not your personal preference.
Manos
Ed Wood’s entire ouvre
The Room
Select Roger Corman
Suburbia
Rocky Horror for sure
I am with you #68. Bad but culturally impacting.
Plan 9
Manos
Rocky Horror
Night Of The Living Dead
I assume Carnival Of Souls is already on its way.
I can’t think of a single Corman that really foots the bill.
Not sure that The Blob is a bad movie.
I think I am with the Logan’s Run crowd although how bad is it really.
I wonder if anyone of you has ever sat through Liquid Sky. Very much like Manos but with more overt drug use.
And I’m gonna throw out Planet Of The Apes.
#44 – The original “The Blob” is certainly not a BAD film, sure, and it’s unique (or nearly so) among sci-fi films of that era in that the bad-boy (sorta) protagonist, in the end, is actually BELIEVED by the town full of Doubting Thomases; moreover, said town of Doubting Thomases rallies to his aid and defense.
However, in my humble opinion, it ain’t got NOTHIN’ on the 1980s remake. Someone else here said that “Short Circuit” is the most 80s movie ever – that may be, haven’t seen SC since its theatrical run, but I would put 1980s Blob right up there as a boiled-down distillation of most everything awesome about the 1980s (most particularly the fantastic, disgusting FX, done the right way, without computers).
The 1980s was, now that I think of it, jam packed full of remakes that did remaking right. I mean, come one, Carpenter’s “The Thing”? Genius.
late to the thread but I don’t see
evil dead or army of darkness.
I’d also add Prince of Darkness. and the various “Escape from”‘s
@schippers #70: The Thing would more accurately be described as a resourcing, as both it and The Thing from Another World are adaptations of Who Goes There? by John W. Campbell.
I liked Liquid Sky :^)
I wonder if Dementia 13 could be considered good enough. I’ve always loved that one. Anyway, as far as any of the MSTied movies go, maybe Robot Monster.
It’s probably in no danger, but I would preserve Irwin Allen’s production of “The Swarm.” In my book, it’s the most entertaining example of how to do everything wrong: the casting is horrible and the clearly-disinterested cast is awful; the direction (by Allen himself) is amazingly incompetent; the script picks a few elements from the vastly-superior novel but otherwise bears NO resemblance to its source (most of the main characters don’t even exist in the novel). The special effects aren’t quite as awful as their reputation, but certainly not up to the standards of the time. The only participant who acquitted himself without embarrassment would be Jerry Goldsmith.
It has the most phenomenal cost-to-result ration failure I’ve ever laid eyes on.
Dammit, “ratio,” not “ration.”
I’ve been thinking about this topic, and I’ve decided that every film prior should at least have a good print available. I’ve got a DVD of the movie Mitchell, and while it’s nice to see the movie in its entirety, the print still sucks. Not every film has to go through the process of preservation, or even high definition remastering, but it should look as good as possible.
As post #58, Creeping-Death mentioned, Rocky Horror has already been cleaned up on BluRay. I believe in the booklet, it was mentioned that it was rescanned at 4k resolution so it’ll be around for years .. as long as no one wipes the hard drive!
That being said, the BluRay is immaculate! I’ve seen the movie hundreds of times, and my friend and I popped it in, meaning to check out the restoration but only for a few minutes. It was so impressive, and we saw so many things that we hadn’t seen before, we ended up watching it from beginning to end.
I’ve owned RHPS from bootleg tape (and LP!) to VHS through to DVD .. IF you are a fan, you NEED to suck it up and buy yet another media configuration.