Following along our search for those rare bits of actual quality in MSTed movies, alert reader Jay (aka Pemmican) turns to the writing and chooses:
…”The Rebel Set,” with its well developed characters and intertwining plotline. A *hokey* plotline – sheesh! – but apparently a storyline that was thought out and delivered at least a meager serving of pathos. Honorable mention? Recent DVD release “Zombie Nightmare.” Did you realize that a lot of the characters from the start of the film show up near the end of it?! Zounds
I think my pick for best written movie would be “Parts, The Clonus Horror.” Yes, it’s executed poorly, but the basic idea and the plot twists are well-plotted and thought provoking.
What’s your pick?
) to help our users cope with "trolls" and other commenters whom they find annoying. Go to our
ummm Hamlet ?
I know no one likes it,But Tormented is a movie I could see sans riffing.The story is good,the acting was ok,it was a coolmovie.
And we always have manos…..jk
LOL! Petite @ 1! Nuff said.
Soultaker was a pretty well written movie. The concept was creative and they managed to put enough effort into the ending to build up a sense of suspense. And having Jimmy Page in one of the supporting roles was a stroke of genius! :lol: Seriously though, even though the finished product probably made the writer(s) cringe when it was completed, the idea behind the movie was pretty good.
Well, Petite wins, but my choices are:
The Rebel Set
Tormented
The Magic Sword (I think of it as a movie for kids, obviously)
I’ll agree with Hamlet; I think, though, the writing takes a backseat to the ridiculous dubbing. I will also agree with Clonus.
However, I’m going to say…Final Justice. It’s a cop caper chase, reused footage aside.
I disagree with Soultaker. While some of the concepts are interesting enough, the actual writing seems on par with a seventh grade English project.
I think Phantom Planet has the best writing, simply for the “You know, Captain, every year of my life I grow more and more convinced that the wisest and the best is to fix our attention on the good and the beautiful. If you just take the time to look at it.”
In all seriousness I would say that Parts is probably the most cerebral (man it sounds weird to say that about it)…..and was also ripped off by The Island. But it was still terrible.
We’re talking about writing here, not necessary all-around execution.
Without reading anyone else’s first, I’d say the following are not bad:
The Crawling Eye
Moon Zero Two
Tormented
The Russo-Finnish gang
The Girl in Lovers Lane
Santa Claus Conquers the Martians (just kidding)
High School Big Shot
Lots of the Universal ones were okay, if not great.
Deadly Bees wasn’t completely tragic
And Hamlet — hey you know that guy could write. Of course the flick’s a turd.
First Spaceship On Venus. As Crow says after the film ends, there’s a lot in the movie that’s pretty good, but the execution leaves you lost in a “miasma of boring technical stuff”.
Of course, Hamlet is the real winner, but who can compete with Shakespeare? Clonus also has some good actors and an interesting, truly frightening premise, but the low budget hampers the execution. Still, Keenan Wynn and Peter Graves give the director something with which to work. Phantom Planet is a fun movie and one of the best post-Joel episodes for me.
I can’t agree with Soultaker or Zombie Nightmare at all, they are dreadful movies each with a ridiculous premise that they try to legitimize with some pathos drummed up by the only sadly believable elements (i.e., the car accident in the former and a murder in the latter) in their otherwise nonsensical stories. I don’t suspending my disbelief at any point during either of those films, a basic requirement for any fantasy film to be considered “good”.
I think that even though the movie hurts final sacrifice works on a certain level. I think if they had more time and money it would have been a more passable movie and there actually was a sembalance of plot. Course I agree with crow that it would have fared better as a television show.
The Girl in Lovers Lane,except for the ending! Tormented is another one I’d pick,too..The Rebel Set wasn’t too bad,except when Mr. T. was “disguised” as the priest..It Conquered the World was fairly good,except for the giant pickle monster..
I’d say “Marooned” (a.k.a. “Space Travelers”) is well-written, as it at least makes an attempt to present a fairly realistic presentation of space travel circa 1970. Still, the story is better presented in Martin Caidin’s original novel (both versions).
Well, Petite wins, but these are my picks (not necessarily in any order):
The Rebel Set
Tormented
The Magic Sword (I think of it as a movie for kids, obviously)
Whoa! TWO movies by Mr. BIG!!
Sorry about the double (okay, triple) posting! :oops:
Not going back on my original comment above but I have to agree with Stranded in Space (Marooned). This movie was released 6 months prior to the near tragic, yet successful, Apollo 13 incident. It probably reflected the tensions, emotions, near tragedy and triumph of the crew and NASA personnel quite realistically. The prescient rather than classical writing makes this movie noteworthy.
I’ve got to go with The Undead on this one. Acutally, most of the Roger Corman movies have well-structured plots that simply don’t translate well to the screen, at least at Corman’s budgets. But The Undead had the Shyamalanian twist of the modern scientist being tricked by the medieval devil, which blew my mind.
Tormented is my choice. Clear story carried through, decent dialog, an actual movie.
Girl in Lovers Lane is my second pick, again for some reasonable dialog & a real plot.
And, Sitting Duck #7 & Mr. B(ob) #10, I’ll disagree with your disagreement about Soultaker. Granted, the premise is like a clever 8th-grader tried to rip off Carnival of Souls, but the execution is a cut above. There are scenes, especially at the beginning, that establish characters through dialog and action, and the movie advances (at least until it gets wedged in the hospital corridors). The first half is a cut above many MSTied movies, and I’d rather watch it, unriffed, than, say, An Officer & a Gentleman.
Perhaps Hamlet could be redone by Tom Cruise. And guess who would play Ophelia. :razz:
Well, it’d be a great movie to riff.
Actually, I imagine there’s a difference between best plotted and best written movie. In the former I’d place Time Chasers (sorry TC haters :mrgreen: ) or OatMB. Best written, actually perhaps The Undead. The first time I saw it (granted as a teenager) I thought it was quite artsy.
I always liked the concepts behind Parts and wonder how Hollywood screwed that one up twice.
Put me down for It Conquered the World. Strong plot, aliens attack with a plan and purpose and an actual emotional connection with the characters. Has the feel of a drawn out Outer Limits ep.
Well, “Hamlet” immediately leaps to mind but then again that’s too easy.
Geez, sooo many turkeys, so hard to pick some decently written, let alone best written…
Um, ok, “Tormented”, “Stranded in Space”, “Phantom Planet” and “Moon Zero Two”. “Space Travelers (aka Marooned)”, “The Painted Hills”.
“Bloodlust” wasn’t bad although it’s a crappy remake of “The Most Dangerous Game”.
That’s about the “best” I can come up with.
A few years ago, I thought, “You know, Clonus isn’t really that bad. It just needs a remake that’s a little smarter.” So, of course, we get Michael Bay blowin’ stuff up. No justice in the world. (Incidentally, “Clonus” has the odd credit “Adapted from a Screenplay by,” which makes me wonder what the original screenplay compares to the movie.)
“Phase IV” is pretty smart, although it’s got the late ’60s/early ’70s disease, where emotion, humor, and character relatability are dialed way the heck down.
Hmm, I think I’m repeating my choices from “MSTed Movies that Deserve a Remake,” although I guess that’s not surprising. Well-written movies are the ones worth doing again. I don’t think I mentioned “Moon Zero Two” last time, so I’ll second that. It’s reasonably smart about space, especially for an adventure film.
The first half of “This Island Earth” is pretty smart for a ’50s SF film, but from the moment they’re taken aboard the saucer, our ostensible heroes are pretty much just along for the ride, no longer figuring things out. (As it happens, the movie’s resemblance to the original novel goes by the wayside here, too.)
“The Deadly Bees” is pretty good all around. Not great, but solid writing.
And finally, “Diabolik” is a little like the Adam West “Batman” with the self-congratulatory cleverness dialed down, and the cool dialed up. So it’s fun and silly, but kind of COOL fun and silly, capturing the fantasy elements of its comic-book world without (overtly) making fun of them.
It’s odd that, when you look at it, there are a pretty good number of MSTed movies that started with a good idea and could’ve turned out fine. It’s just that they ended up taken a turn for the worse when actually being made.
For example, “Moon Zero Two” is an enjoyable movie with an interesting premise. But you just can’t get past Catherine Schell looking like Gumby and the “funny” animated titles.
Aside from Hamlet:
Last of the Wild Horses. It also gets my vote for movie that didn’t deserve the MST treatment.
Actually, I’m going to risk derision and say that the main problem with “Santa Claus Conquers the Martians” isn’t its writing, but its terrible production values (and some truly awful performances.) It’s a clever plot, really. The children of Mars are taught by machine, and so grow up too fast. The Martians decide to kidnap Santa Claus and bring him to Mars to bring joy and laughter to the Martian children, but some grumpy parents are against it.
Let me put it to you this way: Imagine Pixar being given that exact same plot, and asked to turn it into a movie. Heck, I think they could probably use the same script (with maybe an extra draft or two.) The problems with SCCtM is all in the staging, not in the writing room.
As MSTied movies go for writing, I always thought The Rebel Set, Girl in Lovers Lane, Tormented, Marooned, and Touch of Satan were all well-written enough to make for very good movies given minor tweeking with dialogue and plot developments. I agree that this category does go hand-in-hand with the “Movies That Could Have Been Better” thread done afew weeks back, all those I listed had potential to be above par with some extra time, attention, and/or budget.
I can’t think of much wrong to say about the story of Girls Town. Polish it up a little, de-sanitize a scene or two; that’s about it, really. Daddy-O also isn’t that bad a story, just derivative.
San Francisco International is competent, at least. Of the various TV pilots passed off as movies in MST3K it’s probably the best. It’s formulaic but what do you expect from a teleplay like that?
I remember how fast”GIRLS TOWN” went by. There was very little padding and the race in the river bed was pretty cool. (I wonder if Don McLane saw this movie? :”Drove my Chevy to the levee…”)
Some trivia: Marooned (SPACE TRAVELERS) was written by Martin Cadin, who also wrote the novel CYBORG, and that story was made into the TV show THE SIX MILLION DOLLAR MAN.
Isn’t the fact that these movies became MST fodder mean that they AREN’T well written?? Oh well if I gotta, I gotta…Manos(just kidding). I really thought Jack Frost, Outlaw and Being from Another Planet were good.
I’ve always thought ahat The Brain that Wouldn’t die had a good story behind it. I also liked the idea behind “Manos”, it’s just a shame that it was directed by a fertilizer distributor. Bloodlust! was good too, but I suppose that story is really just an adaptation of the Most Dangerous Game…
It’s gotta be Kitten With A Whip for me. Very snappy writing, a well structured plot that actually moves along (but gets kinda jumbled near the end) and a handful of rememberable characters. I always have fun while watching this episode and it’s mostly because the movie is so engaging.
I’m not going to count Hamlet, since I hardly think that the script was originally intended for the silver screen, thus no one actually wrote a true “screenplay” for the film. It’ll come as no surprise when I support “Clonus,” as I’ve lauded it in the past.
As for “Tormented,” it was decently written, but I think that it was the acting, rather than the writing, that mostly elevated that film. Obviously you need both to make a successful film. Just look at David Warner in “Delta Knights.” He’s a very good actor, but no amount of talent could make those lines come out well. Kinda like the Star Wars prequels I guess.
So I’ll stick with “Clonus,” with an honorable mention for “Tormented.” I’ll also give “The Undead” a mention, because I think that Corman’s original screenplay was probably pretty good, before it was hacked to pieces by the studio. There’s still some pretty decent dialogue delivered, but serious problems with execution and budget weigh heavily on the whole production.
There’ve been many times I’ve found myself thinking “This could be remade into a pretty decent movie.” I think it boils down to the fact that the Brains tended to go with the best films they could acquire to the rights to. (“Best” being a relative term, naturally.) As Frank points out in the ACEG, painfully dull movies like Starfighters and Radar Secret Service were used out of desperation, and the truly unwatchable ones were rejected, so despite what the theme song says, the films featured on MST3K were actually the BEST that the Mads could get ahold of.
Anyhoo… Just the other night I was watching Swamp Diamonds and found myself once again thinking that it would make a pretty good cheap exploitation movie even today. Not a great work of art by any means, but you really can’t miss combining womens’ prison, undercover cop, and treasure hunt flicks. I’m surprised Paul Verhoeven hasn’t remade it already.
More on topic, I’d say First Spaceship On Venus, Moon Zero Two, Tormented, Giant Spider Invasion (minus the black hole technobabble), and Parts: The Clonus Horror were pretty well written. Clearly Michael Bay agreed with me about Parts. But then again, what the hell does he know about good screenwriting?
Creeping Terror, hands down. that one just wrote itself.
just kidding
Actually though, the 2 Joe Don Baker movies were fairly well put together plot wise. If they hadn’t stared JDB they might have actually been good.
I thought Girl in Lovers Lane was acctually well written, untill the ending. Other than that misdeed I’d say it was the best movie they ever did.
Maybe there should be two catagories, best original and best adapted screenplays. Original I’m going with Time Chasers, after all the four of the characters are killed and there’s still a happy ending. Adapted I’m going with Riding With Death, just kidding.
Kitten with a Whip has an interesting premise, but the villains are just not threatening enough, and the psuedo beatnik ramblings gum up the works, This is an episode that I find myself tuning out the riffs sometimes to try and follow the story.
The Thing that Wouldn’t Die is also an interesting story. Pare it down a little and I always thought it would make a good X-files episode.
Yes, it was boring and had that butting heads melodrama popular then, not to mention Hackman’s extreme case of Cafard but the one that popped into my head was Space Travelers (Marooned). Red Zone Cuba anyone?
While I enjoy the conversations, I can’t say much for the topics of the past several weeks including this one.
These things would seem to be mutually exclusive, and not ideas that would come to the mind of the average joe watching mst3k for a good laugh.
I’m gonna take the fifth on this one – (go finish watching Killers from Space for the fifth time). That’s a funny one!
A Peter Grave! Hah ha!
I would have to say The Girl In Lover’s Lane. And, like everyone else who voted for that one, the ending ruined it from being a tolerable movie.
The Beatniks also wasn’t horrible, despite the fact that there were NO Beatniks in the movie.
Did someone really say Red Zone Cuba??? Good Grief! Get a hold of yourself! :)
Wisecracker
I always thought Gunslinger was a fairly decent movie. The plot isn’t ridiculous, there are some moments of snappy dialogue, and the leads (Beverly Garland and John Ireland) are pretty darn good–they even have palpable chemistry. Considering that the movie was made in ’56, it was pretty forward-thinking (a female sheriff?!?!!), and it also had an ambivalent antihero in John Ireland, which you really didn’t see until movies like Clint Eastwood’s Unforgiven.
I also like watching Beverly–she’s hot!
The Crawling Eye and Clonus. I actually think I was a teenage werewolf is pretty good as well as The Leech Woman. It’s a good premise even if it’s executed poorly.
For some reason the story to Riding with death isn’t bad at all and Escape 2000 with a much better cast maybe lol
# 39 Wisecracker
“I’m still holding it” Young Frankenstein
with one note if you can get past the invisibility part of the riding with death…
The plot of Bloodlust! has potential in competent hands (crazy aristocrat lures people to his island to hunt them like game animals). They could rename it Ted Nugent Island. Box office smash!
Randy
Well, ‘Hamlet’ is obviously a classic – just crappily re-edited and dubbed in this case. As far as original fare, I do think ‘Tormented’ had an interesting set up and enjoyable story. Heck, as a ‘ghost story’ I put it above some of the bigger-budgeted effort such as ‘The Haunting.’ It really is one of the few MST3K movies I could watch and enjoy without the riffing.
This Island Earth
Parts: The Clonus Horror was not well written it just had an interesting concept
“Time Chasers”
An interesting concept and it certainly has more ambition some of the big-budget slop that has been unleashed over the last few years. If the movie had a budget over $20.00 plus the change found in the director’s couch and some real actors in the leads, it could have been halfway decent little flick.
#49
For 20 dollars?!? It’s impossible to get a decent little… Oh !
Never mind