Movie: (1959) When a doctor’s fiancee is decapitated, he keeps her head alive in his laboratory and tries to find her a new body.
First shown: 10/30/93
Opening: Mike’s been in training for his first movie
Invention exchange: Mike presents the gutter-bumber-shoot, The Mads demonstrate the dream buster
Host segment 1: Mike tries to get control of the SOL, but nothing doing (that’s not cheese!)
Host segment 2: M&tB first project together: designing hats for Jan in the pan
Host segment 3: Mike, Crow and Tom discuss the movie’s hateful message; Mike shares an embarrassing moment from his past
End: A visit from Jan on the Hexfield; Dr. F. is inspired!
Stinger: “Who’s to tell me to blow if I don’t want to?”
(201 votes, average: 4.47 out of 5)
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• A fair-to-good first show for Mike. Horrible movie, great riffing, but many many changes to the forumla.
• This was one of the two episodes that was first released as singles by Rhino, in April of 2000, their first two MST3K titles.
• References.
• I spent most of October 30, 1993, in Edina, Minn., at the home of a very nice lady named Debbie Tobin, with a lot of oddly dressed people I’d never met before. Thereby hangs a tale.
For the previous two Thanksgivings, Comedy Central had paid Best Brains to create short film segments — called “bumpers” in showbiz lingo — that would link one episode to another in its annual “turkey day” marathon. But in 1993, for reasons that will never be understood, I guess, Comedy Central asked BBI to make the bumpers for free. BBI told CC to pound sand. So, CC was forced to look elsewhere for its bumpers.
Now, at the same time, Debbie, who was a regular poster at MST3K bulletin board on the Prodigy online service, had announced she was throwing a Halloween costume party on the day of Mike’s first episode. Somebody at CC saw her posting and asked her if they could send a video crew to film it and make bumpers out of the footage. Debbie agreed, and was (wisely) told to keep it a secret, and most of the people who showed up had no idea the camera crew was going to be there.
Thus on the appointed day I, and about 35 jolly people from all over the country, were in Debbie’s house, in costume. It was the first time Erhardt and I had met, and there were a couple of other people there who I’m still good friends with all these years later.
(And let me just take time out from this story to say that if you were there at MSTieween, please drop me a line and let me know how your life is going.)
We managed to finish up filming just before 5 p.m. local time, when this episode was to debut. Shouting “movie sign!!” we rushed to the basement and the den, where TVs were set up so we could watch. And that’s where I was when the Mike era began.
• There is a LOT to take in here, right off the bat. New theme song lyrics, a new theme song singer, a new robot roll call and a new door sequence, all in about two minutes. It was breathtaking at the time.
• One of the new doors in the door sequence looks vaguely like a pizza. This was a cute reference to the fact that many fans claimed that one of the Joel-era doors made a sound that sounded like somebody saying “pizza!”
• According to BBI, Gypsy says “I’m not ready!” It sounds to me like “Hi from me!”
• Crow and Tom have been “training” Mike using “The Beast of Yucca Flat” [sic]. I think this is only the second time they mention a movie that they would later riff — the other one being “Marooned.” There’s also a mention of “Night of the Lepus,” a movie they SHOULD have riffed.
• Is Tom wearing a Temple University cap? Sure looks like their “T.”
• Right out of the box, Mike is intentionally different from Joel. In an interview that I did with Jim at about this time, he said (I’m paraphrasing from memory here) “I never quite understood why Joel’s character is so polite and deferential to the Mads. They trapped him in space! Why is he being nice to them?” Thus we have an immediately rebellious Mike, who scoffs at being expected to “hop to.” Radical!
• I love the use of the “Flint phone” sound effect with Dr. F’s invention. The world would later hear it in the Austin Powers movies too.
• Another great “Mike as newbie” moment comes when moviesign arrives — and Mike has no idea what to do. He then fails to carry a humiliated Tom into the theater. Crow explicitly mentions the air grate.
• Segment 1 is our first real taste of interaction between Mike and bots. They seem to be getting along okay, but it’s clear the bots have abandonment issues. Can bots have “issues”?
• I gotta say that this movie is pretty harsh for Mike’s first experiment. It is easily the most misogynist movie they ever did (and that’s saying something). The scene where our “hero” goes trolling for bodies is particularly dark.
• Callback: “Back to the ‘Unearthly’ set.” “Mitchell!!”
• At one point, Tom says: “Not with RADAR!” Huh? We won’t get “Radar Secret Service” for seven episodes. Is it a reference to that? Had the Brains already seen it as part of the selection process? Maybe that was a riff that came from Frank, the previewer.
• Segment 2 is fun, a bit a throwback to season 3, when Joel was forever giving the bots assignments and projects.
• Mike is still wearing the lazy susan hat when when they re-enter the theater.
• Tom does a little Flash Bazbo.
• Segment 3 seizes another opportunity have fun at the new guy’s expense, but also has some wonderful assessments of the movie.
• Great running gag in this one: AHH! I’M IN ANOTHER DIMENSION!!
• Cast and crew roundup: Just one item this time: Makeup man George Fiala also worked on “Santa Claus Conquers the Martians.”
• CreditsWatch: Joel’s name comes off the “art direction” credit, leaving Trace and Jef. Skyline Displays Inc. (the company that offered them the space that would become their studio) comes out of the “Special Thanks” credit, as does the credit for Mark Gilbertson. The “Executive Producers: Jim Mallon, Joel Hodgson” credit comes out completely. David Sussman is added to the list of writers for the rest of the season. Host segments directed by Trace Beaulieu. For the rest of the season, the theme song credit says: lyrics: “The Brains.” Jim Mallon is back in the list of contributing writers (his name was removed in last week’s credits) and will be for the rest of the season. And of course that’s Mary Jo, hilariously depicting Jan in the pan.
• Fave riff: “Hahahaha…have you seen Frankenhooker?” Honorable mentions: “…with a Milwaukee Sawzall.” “If Jack Ruby owned a Denny’s.”
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Let us not forget this episode features Mary Jo as Jan in the Pan.
One of my all-time favorite riffs was from this movie – when we get the POV losing consciousness shot:
“my MOthEr gAVe Me thAT GLaSs iT WAs a famILY heIRlOoM!” :grin:
In the ACEG book, Frank mentions that Radar Secret Service was previewed for season 2, but they couldn’t get the rights to it then.
I love the reference to Mel Blanc: “You’re goin out with me varmit!”
Missed Riff Oppurtunity: When the closet monster first shows his face, I expected a Sloth/Goonies reference. Instead, we get a Boo Radley/To Kill a Mockingbird reference. Which somehow, to me doesn’t fit.
There are certain words during the Joel era, that were totally absent during the Mike era. Ex. Joel and the Bots would use the word “kooky” to describe something crazy. This word is almost never used during the Mike era.
Another note, we won’t see the “G” symbol again until 1001- Soultaker.
The Gutterbumbershoot is by far the only “cool” invention Mike ever made.
I really liked this one. My favorite exchange went something like this:
“All you men give me the same old tired lines”
“I’d like to lop your head off and put another one on your body”
“Well, that’s different”
Another grand episode for me ( I’m a sap, there aren’t many MST3Ks I don’t like ).
As with others, this has that awful old-fashioned B&W tawdryness that I love so much. Shopping for fresh bodies, strippers, the damaged people, the deceptions, the freak.
My favorite little tiny piece of this one is when Mike makes a reference to an earlier episode ‘before’ ‘Mike’ was ‘on the show’ and one of the bots expresses surprise… how do you know about that? playing with the context is fun.
Didn’t amazing Radar play a big part in the Commondo Cody shorts ? or are my neural plaques acting up a again ?
Yes, I’m in another dimaension is brilliant.
The stripper’s interpretive dance menu bit is a fave of mine as well.
The whole idea of strippers as being mainstream co-ed ( if not exaclty family friendly ) entertainment still amazes me.
I can’t think of anything wrong with this one.
( Samp: I think there was another ‘call-forward’ somewhere, must.. struggle… to think and… remember. )
This was my first ever episode (after having seen MST3K: The Movie on British telly). This was the first to arrive through the mail and so Mike’s first is also mines.
It’s a good episode but as I saw more it started to slide down the list.
There’s the call-forward to Coily the Spring Sprite when Crow did “Willy the Waffle”.
Later in this season, there’s a call forward to the Mole Men…since we basically get a sneek peek at that movie in “The Wild, Wild World of Batwoman.”
Anyway, two things I “should really just relax” about, but can’t, as they’ve made me wonder for a while now.
1)Do you think, story wise, it’s possible that the bots showed Mike some of Joel’s work riffing movies…hence why Mike knows things like Gamera, Jet Jaguar and the like in later riffing?
2)OK, I can understand getting rid of everything referencing Gizmonics Institute, as that was TMed by Joel. What I DON’T really get is why they felt the need to change the doors to the theater. I mean…personal preference, I like the Joel door sequence. It just seemed weird to me that they would go through the trouble of changing it. Was there a real reason ever given for why they chose to do this?
Anyway…as for the riffing…
“Hey, you’re not my dad! You’re Hitler!”
and I always get a laugh how long and strung out the deformed handed scientist’s death-scene was.
and…
Scientist>They’d turn away from me in fear
Mike>And then I’d show them my hand!
Probably one of the best episodes of Season Five. I love the scene where Our Hero trolls the neighborhood looking for bodies. (“At least he’s not arousing suspicion!” shouts Tom.) The overacting scarred model at the end of the film is hilarious, too.
In comparison, the endless scenes where Jan and the lab assistant are talking tend to put me to sleep. They must have thought the dialogue had the weight to carry the scenes, but they were wrong.
The whole “Beast of Yucca Flat[s]” reference threw me, especially once we got to the later episode, and they act like they’ve never seen it before. Weird continuity breach.
(I know, I should really just relax yada yada.)
Mike is a lot more laid back in this episode compared to later on. His riffs seem deliberately quiet, almost as if he doesn’t want to outshine Joel. Tom seems like he’s yelling every line in comparison.
However, it ends with him inadvertently pissing off a visitor to the SOL, a consistent theme in the Mike episodes (“12 to the Moon,” “Devil Fish”). Mike’s tenure as SOL ambassador is off to a stumbling start.
Re: “My favorite little tiny piece of this one is when Mike makes a reference to an earlier episode ‘before’ ‘Mike’ was ‘on the show’ and one of the bots expresses surprise… how do you know about that? playing with the context is fun.”
That gag does not occur in this episode, but in season 6’s The Sinister Urge.
Chris #7: I remember reading somewhere that BBI felt the door sequence (and sets) hadn’t kept up with the rest of the show’s improving production quality.
I never did get the whole “it’s not cheese” thing. :oops:
I like this movie, an early gore movie,cheap low budget fun..
This is the ep where every character did a 180, Dr F and Frank got more feminine/ gay or something ( I know Dr F wore leggings in Mighty Jack, but it was just that one episode) on a consistent basis. Crows voice changed as did Servo’s persona..
They did wipe out Gizmonic totally
When they did say RADAR I had felt that they had watched an upcoming episode or something…
[ Invader Pet (#9). whoops, I’d better go back and screen both tonight. Damn the responsabilities of a grown up job. ]
Ahh. The reference to Frankenhooker. I used to love annoying folks with that one at the video store. It had a tinny little built in speaker that screeched out “Wanna date?” when you pushed a button. Juvinile, I know. But at the time, it was kinda funny…
Anyway, not my favorite episode, but I love how smoothly Mike picks up the torch. As a seasoned Doctor Who fan, I know there’s usually a lousy “break-in” episode or two before the new guy really gets going, but that doesn’t happen here. Granted, that has a lot to do with Mike’s prior intimate association with the show, but it’s impressive all the same.
#7: You forget that there were Mole People in Deep 13 during seasons 2 and 3. I’m personally surprised that they never mentioned Jerry and Sylvia during the actual Mole People episode.
What gets me about this movie is how somebody added a ‘Meow’ for that shot of the cats painted on the wall. I’m quite sure it didn’t come from Mike or the Bots. Could it be a reference to the catfight we had just left, I wonder.
Given Mike’s reaction to the two showgirls fighting each other, I wonder how he would have taken the devil lady fighting sequence from Manos.
I think the idea is that from the way Gypsy says, “It’s not cheese,” the unspoken implication is that you really, really don’t want to know what it actually is. :)
And it’s cool that you talked about those bumpers! For many years, the only MST3K I got was by going over to my sister’s apartment on Thanksgiving and taping MST3K until I passed out, then watching those episodes over and over for a whole year. So those bumpers form a major part of my MST3K memories. (Along with the contest-winner, who kept pronouncing “E-Die-naw” as “Eh-Dee-Nuh”. It never stopped hurting.)
Honorable mention: “Ironically he falls into an armchair.”
I loved that one!
Everything’s new in MST3K-land in this episode. While I like Mike, he’s definitely no Joel and so I felt the show missed something afterwards. Still he was as good a replacement host as any and I really can’t think of anybody else that could fill Joel’s shoes.
There are several funny Mike CC era eps, but this is not one of them for me. In this case it was the movie. So slow and plodding. It reminded me of something from season 2. The riffs just didn’t do it for me because the movie was so dreary. However this movie is gold compared to 515 Batwoman. Oh lordy did that movie get on my nerves.
In addition to this episode and the mention of Marooned/Space Travelers in “Rocketship X-M”, there are two other instances of the guys referencing a movie they’ll see in later episodes: Crow mentions The Beginning of the End during his report on Bert I. Gordon at the end of “Earth vs. the Spider”, and Servo mentions The Legend of Boggy Creek during “The Sword and the Dragon” (I know, they did Boggy Creek II, but close enough, right?)
#7 Chris Waters: Mary Jo mentioned in the ACEG that the Joel-era door sequence looked old and out-of-date compared to the show’s sense of art direction in mid-Season 5, which prompted them to do the new one for the Mike era. (I think there was some talk about changing it again when the show went to the SciFi Channel, but the idea was abandoned.)
I’m still not over Joel leaving the show, but that said, this is a pretty funny episode. I remember how me and my wife sat down to watch this one with great anticipation to see how the changes would be handled in switching hosts. We were impressed with the way it was handled in spite of the disappointment at losing Joel Hodgson.
I particularly like the training session for Mike at the beginning. “Now you know why they call it ‘V'” is still a joke that makes me laugh. I also still really enjoy the “Jan in the pan” sketch at the end.
I’ll say one thing in favor of Mike that i think most people here agree with: Mike’s tenure as host of this show was better compared to any other show that lost it’s original creator. For example, the complete decline that Ren and Stimpy suffered under the hands of Bob Camp after John K. was fired (though, oddly enough, both shows faced cancellation after two more seasons).
This is one of those movies that squicks me out bad enough to affect my experience of the episode. I feel better about it after that segment discussing how hateful it is, and I think Mike-as-New-Guy is adorable and the riffing is funny, but it’s not one I like to rewatch.
I view Joel as the Art Student and Mike as the Frat Boy. And to some extent I see this extended respectivvely to CT ( kind of mannered and stiff ) and Rifftrax ( let’s riff everything woohoo kegger ). They are autonomous beings with their own personalties of course ( and I know neither of them personally, or at all ) But I feel that the ever so slighty different eras they grew up in has informed their work
Joel, born in 1960, is in a postion to remember Woodstock, the RFK and MLK assassinations ( maybe even JFK but that’s a stretch ), the Manson killings, the Vietnam War, Altamont, The Beatles as a current going concern.
And I think it shows. Joel is darker than Mike, and more serious. not that Mike can’t be dark, but Joel’s darkness pains Joel himself more.
Mike might remember vaguely some of the items listed above, but more tellingly he would have seen the end of the Vietnam war, not the build up, and he would have been aware of Watergate and Nixon, but not Eugene MaCarthy & LBJ. Disco affected his impressionable mind at an early age. The early seventies were so different from the late sixties.
I am almost exactly halfway between Mike and Joel in age.. my ex-wife is 2 years older than Joel. So she and I have the same age difference, and we noticed that there were signficant differences in our cultural landmarks ( She remembers 11.22.63 clearly, while I was 15 months old ), and that these landmarks informed our personalities. Perhaps a similar analysis may show similar structural differences bewteen Joel and Mike.
Where was I going with this…. I don’t remember. Oh yeah, this is how I view the differences between Host Joel and Host Mike.
I do like Host Mike slightly better, but not in any way that diminishes Host Joel ( love H. Joel, love H. Mike slightly more ). But the writing of the show lost a certain seriousness, a certain so-pained-almost-not-funny-anymore darkness, when Joel moved on.
yes, yes, who the hell do I think I am, I don’t know these people, I probably don’t even know myself as well as I should, it’s just a show, I should really just relax…
but it’s hot and stuff, and I taste metal.
I do also notice the less serious nature when Mike took over, Mr. Petite. I’m guessing that Joel was behind some of those discussion segments and such…hence we get more things like Tom blowing up Crow, the “Love, Sattellite Style” sketch and the like.
…incidentally, I STILL want to see SOMETHING riffed by both Joel AND Mike.
I certainly noticed a “so-pained-almost-not-funny-anymore darkness” in the Joey the Lemur sketch. :wink:
The whole premise of this schlocky bore of a film makes not a tiche of sense. Guy drives stupidly fast to a cabin full of medical horrors, kills his betrothed, turns her into a medical horror and then trolls for babes, with their heads attached, all of whom think he’s dreamy. Any halfway reasonable person would’ve dumped Jan in the pan for one of the whole women with half a brain. But this is why bad movies are the way they are. Those moments, sometimes endlessly unraveling moments of overwhelming “HUH?” and “DUH!” that make the final cut.
Randy
I like this episode. But, then again, I like almost every episode. It’s part of my rotation of episodes to watch before shtemlo.
Most of my favorite episodes are Joel-era, but that’s because of when I began watching the show. (“Rocketship XM” was the first I ever saw, which was a result of channel surfing. “Sidehackers” was the first I ever tuned in to watch.) So, I think I’m predisposed to like Joel-hosted episodes because they’re how I discovered the show. If I’d started watching later, as I’m sure many did, I understand how Mike would seem better.
I think the real debate surrounding the show is not Joel v. Mike. It’s the highest profile debate because, well, Joel and Mike were the show’s highest profile contributors. So naturally they dominated the episodes they hosted and starred in. Instead, I think a debate that better captures the evolution of the show is Trace v. Bill. Both Crows were wisecrackers to be sure and each delivered great riffs. But I always found Bill’s Crow to be more affronted by and aggressively hostile toward the movie, whereas Trace’s Crow was more observational and passively critical. As an example, regard how Trace’s Crow and Bill’s Crow each treated Joe Don Baker. The tone of the anti-Joe Don comments changes significantly between the two. (Another example: how Trace’s Crow dealt with a Van Patten as opposed to how Bill’s Crow dealt with an Estevez.) So this might also mean that fans who discovered the show during Bill’s tenure might also place themselves in the pro-Mike camp. I know this holds for me: I prefer Trace’s Crow to Bill’s Crow and so my favorite episodes are from the (mostly Joel-hosted) Comedy Central-era.
Anyway, this is, no matter the host or the voice of Crow, like, the best show of all time.
I love Tom’s perfectly timed accented “Hiiii.” with the closeup on one of the strippers.
That whole “I’m in another dimension!!” stuff is classic. Cracks me up every time.
Can those Halloween bumpers be seen anywhere?
“Shopping for fresh bodies, strippers, the damaged people, the deceptions, the freak”
…sounds like my workplace!
Okay, remembrances off the top of my head:
I wouldn’t be surprised if the ‘bots showed Mike previous movies(just the movies, no riffs) as part of Mike’s training.
I can’t recall any other episode explaining why Joel/Mike had to carry Tom into the theater. It’s probably in a season 1 episode I haven’t seen yet.
The Poopie reel had an outtake of the balloons popping in the invention exchange without the ‘Flint Phone’ sound effect. They all didn’t pop, and Trace said, ‘Never mind.’
I’ve said this in other MST related places, but I can’t remember if I said it here or at the Discussion Board, so I’ll repeat it: The ‘bots had different relationships with Joel and Mike for a very simple reason: Joel created them, so they acted like his children, while Mike was like their little brother that they could always pick on(and I know this since I’m the youngest of my family, so I always sympathize with Mike). We see this in their reaction to his revealing his accident, and when Jan leaves the Hexfield, when Tom says ‘Good one, Nelson!’
Chris Waters: I think that the Brains just decided to change the door sequence since they had to change everything else(new theme song, new singer, no more ‘G’ logo on the door or on the Mads’ unifotrms), so they went ahead with the changes.
Underwoc: I wonder if the creator of Frankenhooker was inspired by the movie. If so, there’s another copyright infringement case potentially! :grin:
Petite: I never thought of Joel as particularly dark, I did think he had a dark side that, as you said, pained him more. I think Mike was more willing to explore his dark side, and that got more pronounced as the show went along.
Whose Line Is It Anyway? used Karl’s death scene(the one where Mike says he fell into an armchair) as a clip for their Film Dub game. I believe this was the first MST film used for that, they would use others, like Teenagers From Outer Space for this. Some funny lines from that:
When the monster’s arm reaches through the door to grab Karl, Colin Mochrie says ‘Buy an encyclopedia!’
As Jan watches Karl die, Ryan Stiles says, ‘Well, now you know how I feel. Ha ha ha ha!’
When Karl falls into the chair, Greg Proops says, ‘Sorry dear, just trying to be disarming!'(Can’t believe they didn’t use that one. :wink: )
About the bad hand scientist’s lonnnnnng death
scene, it seems to put the lie to a certain
British actor’s (Donald Wolfit?) view “Dying is easy, comedy is hard.” Unless, of course, the scene was really an attempt at using a dying scene for comedy-in which case they may have tried too hard, or maybe not hard enough…
Agh :!:
“Joel, born in 1960, is in a postion to remember Woodstock, the RFK and MLK assassinations ( maybe even JFK but that’s a stretch ), the Manson killings, the Vietnam War, Altamont, The Beatles as a current going concern.”
I do remember JFK’s assassination. Oh my god, I am SO old.
I thought this was a perfect episode for Mike’s first experiment. We hadn’t had a good old black/white horror movie since “Bride of the Monster”!
Click on my name above for my full review.
‘Nother question – Again, I didn’t see MST3K episodes in sequence, but I understand that there were some pretty deep rifts created between Joel lovers and Mike lovers. Was the fur flying soon after this show, or did it take awhile for things to heat up? I’m not trying to open old wounds, but only to learn. Theenks!
I noticed on Teenage Strangler that Mike suddenly breaks into Torgo’s voice near the end of the film. However, at that point, Torgo had yet to make an appearance in a Mike episode so it would be impossible for Mike (the character) to know what he sounded like. Of course, the Bot might have shown Manos to Mike as part of his training. I know, I know. I should really just relax.
I think the Mads got a little more development during Mike’s tenure. I noticed there were more skits showing how, um, “close” Dr. F and Frank were as well as more focus on the individual characters. I guess since the invention exchange was phased out, the Mads needed new material in their interactions with the SoL.
I watched those Thanksgiving bumpers. (Skyroniter has all the Thanksgiving host segments on a DVD -Plug!)
Sampo: Were you one of the guests that had a speaking part? I remember some of them introducing themselves and describing an episode that was running. Oddly, I never saw ANY of the MST3K turkey day marathons! I guess I was always not at home or something. Seeing these in between episodes was probably cute, but seeing them all together, one after the other, was, well — annoying.
As for “The Brain That Wouldn’t Die” (or Head That Wouldn’t Die, as it says in the end credits – Crow corrects them, wink wink):
This wasn’t one of the better Mike CC eps. Other than the fact that it’s Mike’s first as the guy on SOL, it’s really not too memorable. It had it’s moments – the ironically falling into an armchair, the I’m-stuck-in-another-dimension stuff, but not one I’m too fond of.
For the theme song -Is that still Joel doing the robot roll call? Sounds like his Croooow. Did they just keep his roll call in there, even in later years it still sounds like him, though with the voice altered, though maybe for the Sci-Fi years they did change it???
One thing I noticed during the cat fight scene – just before, the brunette stripper is taking off a stocking. Did she have that OVER other stockings? Looks like she’s still wearing them after she takes the knee-high one off.
This is getting long, sorry folks.
About the Mike era – really missed the family feel they all had for each other. It’s still present to some to degree here in the CC eps, but it seems to get lost more and more as the years go by and they just seem to get more mean spirited and kind of lose their chemsitry with each other.
I do like some of the Mike CC eps, though.
To be continued…
This is actually the very first episode that I ever saw with Mike as the host.
It is not an easy job taking over for a living legend like the other guy was to so many fans, but he was up to the challenge. Good job new guy.
Is it true that there were actual treats to his life when he was announced as the replacements for the original host?
As for Joel being so passive to his captives was due to the fact that the scientist could turn of his oxygen anytime they wanted so he had to stay in line, this is also the reason he had to go into the theater during movie sign the flashing lights were an indication that the oxygen was about to be cut off so he had to go into the theater because it was the only place with breathable air. Right?
All and all both host are excellent and good time were had by all.
My theory on the Joel/Mike thing:
The changes we saw (aside from on-camera performance style) had little to do with the host change, and everything to do with the true nature of the Joel/Jim conflict(which I’ll get to momentarily).
I’ve always suspected that Joel never actually wrote very many host segments, and acted more as the resident Idea Man, while Mike was writing a lot more of the finished Joel-era sketches than we suspect.
A good example is the Christmas Essay sketch: the 60’s office party essay (and the whole essay-writing idea) is very Joel, but the way it was written bears the goofy, precise, coal-black fingerprints of Mr. Mike Nelson. This accounts for the supposed “darkness” in the Joel era. Both eras were equally dark; it just seemed more pronounced coming from Joel.
Bottom line: The show’s overall “tone” was Joel’s doing (with contributions from Trace – though that’s just a hunch), while Mike and the other Brains filled in the details.
And now, time for the blind theorizing. Your mileage may vary…
The changes enacted immediateley upon Joel’s departure (longer storylines, more character development, fewer “conversation” sketches), were likely things that Jim, the pragmatist to Joel’s idealist, had been pushing for years to make the show more accessible. The seemingly minor nature of these changes were why Jim could never understand Joel’s objections to them.
Joel, on the other hand, had created the show shortly after walking away from a huge, steaming pile of sitcom cash in the name of creative integrity. His disillusioning time in Hollywood probably left him *very* averse to any notion of making his new baby more “tv-friendly”.
So. Small changes, big argument. In the end, they were both right. Personal host preferences aside, the show *was* more accessible to the casual/new viewer in The Mike years. Had Joel stayed longer than he did, MST still would’ve been cancelled when Herzog got his oily little rat paws on it, and Joel still would have bailed; no way would he have agreed to the changes requested by SciFi.
But making the show more conventional (and thus more complicated than it needed to be) led to creative stumbles in the SciFi years. To be fair, changing the show was unavoidable due to the aforementioned Scifi requests, although it didn’t help that BBI had by then also lost Trace and Frank.
Thus ends my overly long, overly parenthetical dissertation on a puppet show.
Question: Was it agreed upon that Joel would do the first half of Season 5 and Mike doing the other or did Joel just go, “Okay, that’s enough. Mike can take it from here”?
I’m not sure I’d call them “creative stumbles”. Certainly, I don’t think Season 8 would have worked as a permanent direction for the series (as Kevin Murphy once said, “We don’t have ‘storylines’, we’re a ‘puppet show'”) but I thought it made for an interesting diversion, a nice change of pace for the series.
Then again, I’m notoriously easy-going. Joel, Mike, Josh, Kevin, Trace, Bill, Frank, Kevin, Trace, Mary Jo, I love ’em all. I have preferences, of course; who doesn’t? But it’s all still fun, no matter who’s doing the riffing.
Talking about refrences to movies that later appeared on mst3k, Mole people If you include the countless refrences in season 2 and the footage in Wild world of batwoman.
This is one of those episodes that I try to avoid, but mostly because of the movie. I am repulsed by the evil nature of the doctor in this movie, and yet the most interesting scenes in the film are when he’s out trolling for bodies. I especially like the scene in which the woman is being photographed by all of those sleazy dudes. My favorite line from Crow in this episode happens here, “And now, Mel Blanc makes his move.” But the rest of the movie is a snooze fest.
Re: #40
Hey, you forgot Paul!
I’ve been compiling a call forward list for sometime now, its slow going and only about four or five long. If anybody has any call forwards please email me at matthew.tait@us.army.mil I’d like to get up to around ten before I submit it for Ward E. Thanks
I remeber nervously waiting on this episode. I was scared Mike wouldn’t do as well as he did in his supporting role in “Mitchell”. I also must admit I don’t like change I even fear it it annoys me. I’ve stayed on too long at horrible jobs because of it but I digest…Mike won me over quickly and I’ve loved both Mike and Joel episodes ever since (I’ve never understood the people that are simply Joel fans or simply Mike fans!!???!!)even though they do have different styles. My favorite part is when Jan loses her head and he’s carrying it around like a football. Being a HUGE sports fan I would have burst out laughing even w-out the riffs. I think Mike started out great and never looked back. Kudos to my fav. show for never missing a beat.
Is it just me, or does Hollywood After Dark feel like an extended version of Brain’s “hunting for suitable bodies” sequence?
this movie’s unflagging repulsiveness fascinates me. its content is as dark and nauseating as its strange lighting and terrible editing. I think the crew of the SOL, with newbie Mike, rise valiantly to the challenge of extracting humor from a film that simply oozes unpleasantness. when the movie dips down into the truly vile, Mike and the ‘Bots pull us unerringly out of the muck with a clever quip. that’s quite an achievement for this stink-burger of a film. I couldn’t watch the entire movie in its original form. as a MST3K episode, I like it, very much.
from the first frames, we are introduced to one of the smarmiest specimens in the canon of oily leading men in MST3K-dom, Dr. Bill Cortner. it seems the reason this guy attended medical school is to have his pick of hot nurses- ok, I can see that- and also to violate his Hippocratic Oath with impunity by abusing his patients, living and dead, to satisfy his dark whims. take home a pile of human parts and have some highly unethical fun? why not? he’s a DOCTOR. he maintains he is doing a great service to humanity by being a twisted monster, treating us to pontificating speeches meant to convince us he’s really a visionary. Cortner may have inherited his less likable qualities from his shifty, misogynist father. this movie seems determined to cram as many depictions of repellent human behavior into itself as it can.
I love the movie’s antique depictions of the whole camera club/dinner theater burlesque sex genres of the 1950s. Dr. Sleaze gets to go shopping for hot, female bodies! the ultimate icky ogler fantasy errand! [I wonder what the audience was like when this movie was first screened?] the strip club scenes are hysterical. watching those two Amazonian creatures exchange barbed insults and ultimately come to blows over the likes of Dr. Sleazy after he’s fondled one’s future scalpel incisions is just plain NASTY. their gigantic female bodies rolling around attacking each other is frightening.
I love the riffing on the sleazy music as ‘K-PORN,’ the ruined hand doctor Kurt’s cartoonish overacting, Jan-in-the-Pan always sporting fresh eyeshadow and lipstick even though she’s a disembodied head in a puddle; the creepy camera club scene [‘she’s doin’ a number four!’ ‘grab a camera, there’s a whole pile of ’em over there’], and the ultimate visceral revenge of cheapie rubber masked Zippy the Pinhead in the closet. [Mary-Jo is also great as Jan-in-the-Pan.]
I showed this episode to two friends who had never seen MST3K. one laughed loudly right from the beginning while the other sat looking terrified. their reactions sum up my own as I watch this episode- but ultimately, the laughter wins, thanks to Mike and the ‘Bots.
Anybody know if any of the bumpers from that Turkey Day are online? I think a few are on the Scrapbook Tape but I don’t know otherwise.
Anywho, very good first episode for Mike. Solid movie, solid sketches. The movie leaves me a bit confused, but that’s alright. Host segments are good. Nothing stands out but it’s Mike’s first show so I’ll cut him slack.
As to the Mike vs. Joel question, if Mike’s good enough for convicts, he good enough for me.
MST3Kelly said: “[I wonder what the audience was like when this movie was first screened?]”
Like most 50’s b-movies, I think most of the audience was busy in the back seat of daddy’s Nash Rambler by the time this flick hit the screen.
nonlocal @ #38:
Your ideas intrigue me, and I’d like to subscribe to your newsletter.
Seriously, I think your points about the show being more accessible after Mike took over as host are well-taken. I’d extrapolate further and point out that the show became even more accessible during the Sci-Fi years.
This postulate could be used to open a discussion about the nature of the fans that came aboard during the later years, as opposed to the original fans, but I don’t think it would be good for this board, so I won’t.